Showing posts with label Starla. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Starla. Show all posts

Starla

[Roman Turner] He had called them together, requesting Starla turn up at the Church also. Even going so far to escort her there if need be, so they could have a long overdue sit down and talk. So far he'd gotten things all from one side and needed both for his own peace of mind. A few things needed ironing out so the kin in the Pack weren't scared and because all the recent drama was sucking his very soul dry.

"First, thanks y'all for showing up. Second, I don't reckon this is going to be entirely pleasant, but it's got to be done."

He'd settled on the back of one of the pews, booted feet resting in the seat. A bottle of water was held dangling between his open knees.

[Starla] She was quiet during the walk to the Church, bottom lip tucked inward as she chews on it absently. A hand lifted to catch and control the stray tendrils of black hair that curls along the line of her jaw. She keeps her head down, eyes on ahead of her on the ground. In the Church, Starla finds a pew to sit down in, drawing her legs up to tuck and fold her feet under her thighs, cross-legged.

She looks up at the others when Roman speaks.

[Fire Claws] There were times that he had missed the Sept he was born at. The discomfort of what happened when drama occurred was one such event. He had already forgotten what had transpired between him and Starla several nights ago. What had been done seem immaterial to wolf born already. A war needed to be fought and he did not waste his time with anything that did not involve ensuring the garou their glory.

However pack issues did arise and he would not negate such an issue. When asked, he would come to the gathering to discuss whatever it was that needed to be discussed. The wolf holding his skin as he paced around the large stone den when the no moon speaks, he finally plants his hind on the cold ground, his tail slowly wiping away at the ground behind him. Ear perked as he listens.

[Sorrow] Fire Claws and Sorrow both heard the request from Roman; Kora reinforced it - firmly, quietly. Beyond the reinforcement, her mind closed, solid as the heavy wooden doors that protect the sanctuary of the long-abandoned church. Roman's sitting on the back of a wooden pew; Kora's standing a few feet away, quiet for now. Heavily pregnant - they must imagine it will be any time now - with her usual dark gray sweatshirt and jeans on to chase away the chill in the sanctuary. This business is not conducted in amongst the comfort of the old ratty couches scattered under the choir loft, but closer to the transept, the altar. There's a certain ruined majesty up here; the ribs of the ceiling evident in the fast-failing light, the clouds beyond have that late evening glow from the dying sun. Half the stained glass windows are enshadowed, dark. The rest are caught between gray and brilliant. The light gleams on the surface, but is too murky to make more than incidental, watery impressions on the marble floor.

There is the scent of storms on the horizon, somewhere close. The Fenrir can feel winter's touch in the air; snow to the north, the gray ache as it reasserts itself against the coming spring.

The Skald's dark eyes flicker between Starla and Fire Claws, attention lingering first on one, then the other before it returns to Roman. Otherwise, her body language is as closed as her mindvoice. "What's this about?"

[Roman Turner] "I've got three things I want to bring out here. The first two involve Starla and Fire Claws. I am first going to say what I have been told, nothing more. Then once this can of worms has been dumped out on the table, we can hash through the mess."

His gray-blue gaze, so much like old faded denim, went from Starla to Fire Claws before he spoke again with a pointed look at Fire Claws.

"I need human ears and words for this. Oblige me by shifting to two legs, please."

Then his gaze included Sorrow.

"Starla tells me first one night Fire Claws came in covered in blood. She decided he needed help that he apparently did not need. He then proceeded to get drunk and she says he used a power as she put it, to make her want him sexually. She says she resisted because he fell asleep. That the next day they spoke of it and he said it is not so. I need both sides of that in the open. That's the first item."

[Starla]

[Sorrow] Kora's standing with her legs shoulder-width apart, hands in the pockets of her sweatshirt, pulling the waistband down below the apex of her abdomen, stretching out the warm cotton. Her hair is pale, gleaming with shifting colors reflecting from the flickering of the braziers on the marble columns, smooth against her scalp, pulled back into a heavy twist at the nape of her neck, some complex internal knot, imprecise, disordered. She cuts a glance from Roman to Starla when he is finished; her ears are bare, and the movement sends the old iron charm dangling from the inner cartilage of her right ear swinging with the movement.

Otherwise, she is still. Dark eyed and steady. "I'd like to hear what happened from you, Starla," says Kora, low-voiced. "In your own words. Then I will have Fire Claws' response."

[Fire Claws] He nodded his head when Roman asked him to take on the monkey skin and he does so to oblige the Fostern coggie. It was a slow transformation through the forms, his fur giving way as he shifts and changes. His body enlarging at first to the massive war form, muscles and sinew given way and explode to part that no creature should be able to have. And soon after the apex of his form, shift and shrink down, muscle no longer massive but contained. Skin exposed to the elements, only hidden by now by the dedicated clothes of faded and worn black jeans, ripped and tattered shirt and boots that have seen better days.

He stands there before the rest of his pack mates, leaning again a pew now as he listens to what has be said. He does not attempt to interrupt Fate~rhya as he listens. Trying to recall an event that seem years ago to the lupus born. His face contorted now as he struggles to recall the event.

[Starla] Starla draws in a deep breath, holding it in her lungs while Roman spoke; it's released slowly, rushing out of her mouth and nose in a small hiss of air. She flicks her eyes to the wolf-born, arching an eyebrow at him, she stares at him hard for several seconds, and then pulls her eyes to Roman - listening.

"Fire Claws wanted to know what it felt like to git drunk. It came out of conversation he had wit' Amy and Rain at the Broho one night, when they's drinking. I found Fire Claws injured and fetched the first aid kit wit' the intentions of cleaning up his wounds, there was a bottle of vodka sitting the table in front of him."

She flicks her gaze up, looking first to Kora and then to Roman, and finally Fire Claws, "He ain't likely gonna remember this; though, he started in on the bottle, I tried to control how much liquor he consumed. I don't what provoked it after that, maybe it was my breeding, me being too close, or the end of mating season for wolves. Next thing I know I was crawling in his lap after meeting his gaze, he did something to try and git me to mate wit' him. I come to my senses and managed to resist before he past out. I confronted him the next day, and he says I lied."

[Roman Turner] Watching Starla as she spoke, his gaze then shifted to Fire Claws with a lifted brow.

"I can tell ya, this first item troubled me and I would of let it lay for a quiet word alone, if not for other things taking place. Now, it's your turn Fire Claws. What do you recall?"

[Sorrow] Kora listens intently, dark eyes fixed on Starla. Her brow is furrowed as she contemplates the kinswoman, her attention keen and direct. When Starla finishes her story, the Skald cuts a moving glance back toward her feral packmate, the Forseti. Briefly, she searches his blunt human features. Then echoes Roman. "Everything you remember of it, beginning to end."

[Sorrow] Per + Empathy [Truthiness + FEELINGS)
Dice Rolled:[ 6 d10 ] 1, 2, 3, 4, 7, 7 (Success x 1 at target 6)
to Starla

[Sorrow] HOW DOES THAT MAKE YOU FEEL.
Dice Rolled:[ 8 d10 ] 2, 3, 4, 7, 8, 8, 9, 9, 10 (Success x 6 at target 6) Re-rolls: 1
to Starla

[Fire Claws] He scrunches his nose at the memory of it. It was hard to recall what had happened, his mind a fuzzy maze of thoughts that didn't seem to flow in chronological order like it does for humans. Thoughts come and go as she begins to speak, his smell of vodka coming to his mind. The sensation revisited when he recalls what he remembers. He shakes out his head. His words come across a mutilated as he speaks.

"Aye ramemba dat night... somewat. Afta' 'unting aye came to den. Sum banes on pack edge. Kill'd em. Cam back wit sum cuts. Starla saw me... sad needed help. Aye needed no help, wounds heal gud. Fine. But smellvodka.. recall da words of kin and..." he tried to think about what the word Rain used when she called it something else, but it seemed lost to the lupus at the moment. "... monkey fire water. Curious."

He looks down, trying harder to push pass the haze of murky memory and what was said. Trying to recall everything. "Drank da fire water. Taste bad, buh made warm. Nice feelin, but kin said musta drink slowa. Sat on me, 'eld bottle away."

He continued to try, closing his eyes tight as he forces himself to remember, to recall. To just put the pieces together.

"Smell da kin... close, smell of vodka, smell of breedin'. Head turnin'. Aye did use attraction on 'er."

[Roman Turner] His nod was curt, a simple single motion.

"It don't matter to me if ya were born with fur and four legs, or as bare as a baby bird with two legs. What matters here is, we are not Wolf, we are not Man. We are Garou. We are the protectors. We walk a fine line between two worlds. I will not take a lack of knowledge and a smell of breeding as excuses. The two of you are at fault here. Learn from this and don't repeat it."

He looked back and forth between them and continued.

"This next part I don't have full knowledge of either. I got a call from Milo telling me Starla was hurt. When I get hold of her she's less than pleasant and tells me that once more it involved Fire Claws. Now Starla, give us that entire story."

[Sorrow] Roman appears ready to move on. Kora gives him a single look; flat and challenging. She is clearly not ready to move on. "I'm not finished," she interrupts, before he invites Starla to tell the next story.

"Starla," Kora cuts a glance back to the kinswoman, her own voice is low, still and quiet. " - you said, the next thing you knew you were crawling in his lap. Did you sit on him to take the bottle away? Or were you drawn in?"

"Fire Claws, you are a Forseti. Tell me what you did wrong that night."

[Starla] Starla takes in another deep breath, her eyebrows furrow inward, nearly touching at its corners. She gathers her hands in her lap, fingers intertwining to wring them together. She scrunches up her nose, dropping her gaze down to watch her hands, tongue running out across her bottom lip.

She flinches under Sorrow's question, lifting her head up to look at her. "Sat on him to git the bottle away and then jus' sort got drawn in from there."

[Roman Turner] His brows worse then furrowed with Starla's admission.

[Roman Turner] ((Ut oh, brain going. Worse=Rose. Don't ask how it came out that way.))

[Fire Claws] His discomfort with the English language was starting to show now as he was struggling to find the correct words to answer his Jarl. He seems to resign himself for the moment and connects to his pack mates if allowed. His words clearer, his accent not coming across within the mind.

~Totemlink~
Weakness. I allowed myself to lose control. I showed weakness over what I wanted at the moment for what was proper. Jarl.

[Sorrow] "That detail," the Skald says, low and direct to Starla, " - is an important one, Starla."

Kora allows Fire Claws to make the mind to mind connection. There is a faint - thinning of her attention in that moment, a drawing-back. She half-closes her eyes, listening to his response, then translates it aloud for Starla a moment later.

"Fire Claws says his failure was weakness. In his weakness, he lost control and allowed his momentary desire to overwhelm his knowledge of what was right and proper, Starla."

Kora glances back to the lupus, then. "Have you been drunk before, Fire Claws?" A brief, foreshortened sort of pause. He can answer through their spiritual connection, but Kora questions him aloud for the benefit of the kinswoman. "Do you intend to drink again?"

[Starla] If the wolf-born intends to drink again, it won't be in the presence of the kin. She tilts her head to the side, watching the interaction between Kora and Fire Claws. She is quiet, no verbal response given to Kora's statement, just a raising of a dark eyebrow.

[Roman Turner] He spoke in response to Starla's brow rising.

"It was not necessary for ya go climb on top of him to control his drinking Starla. You are not responsible for Fire Claws' drinking if he wants. But by climbing on him ya put both of you in a situation. You too are at fault."

[Fire Claws] He watches how Sorrow reacts to his words, how she repeats what he says and his eyes are given to look at the ever-increasing stomach that has formed over their Jarl. His eyes no meeting with the coggie at one moment or another during the situation. Just speaking when addressed from those of rank.

"No" and "No" are the only response given, or needed for that matter. Not like a child answering his mother out of habit, but one who understands that he does not like what happened because of what he did.

[Starla] Being at fault, she understood, Starla was shouldering that guilt along with the one that had come from last Monday. If it hadn't been for Milo, they wouldn't be here having this conversation. Starla would have just buried it and never mentioned it to anyone, hoping that Fire Claws would have forgotten or not broached the subject.

She has no verbal response to Roman's words, her head bowing again to drop her eyes to her hands.

[Sorrow] "Roman's right," Kora echoes, glancing at Starla. "I'm sorry that he tempted you, and glad that you were able to resist him. I will not blame you for his actions; in the end, he is the Garou and bears the burden himself. But, Starla, you were unwise. To remain in the room with a Garou who was drunk; with a lupus Garou who had never before been drunk. Foolish to sit on his lap when his inhibitions are lowered. You know that he is wolf-born, that he is Garou. If you wanted to stop him from getting drunk, you should have found one of his packmates," a tight glance.

--

Then she looks back to Fire Claws, speaking aloud for Starla, reinforcing it across their spiritual bond. "Fire Claws, we do not take our human-born kin as mates through compulsion. They are not wolves, they are not ruled by instinct. The matter of respect for those beneath us is written into the litany, but there's a practical side to it as well. If you violate the trust of your kin, they will desert you one by one.

"And we cannot live without kin, not in these cities. We will never win the war against the Wyrm without them.

"You also violated another's territory. Starla is kin to the Children of Gaia. She is Fate's kin, his territory, and by tempting her to mate with you, broke the law in spirit if not in fact.

"This is your punishment from me: you will not drink spirits of any sort for one moon. Thereafter, if you wish to drink you must do so in the presence of your packmates for another moon. I will not deny a warrior of Fenris mead, but you must show that you are strong enough to stand up to its effects.

"Second, you will not be permitted to court or mate any kin for the space of the same moon."

[Sorrow] "Now," a lifting glance, back to Roman, her voice taut, her countenance stark, strained. "What is the next matter?"

[Roman Turner] "Now, the other issue. Milo contacted me in concern over Starla, she was injured. She implied it was Fire Claws and due to some thing she said to him."

He looked at Starla as he spoke.

"Your side first Starla. The entire story, including what ya said."

[Starla] This is where she grows irritated, a little scowl playing across her features at the mention of Milo. She keeps her voice low, fingers clenched together as Starla works the tension out that forms in the line of her jaw, teeth grinding. She clears her throat a little, "Fire Claws and I went to Chinatown for food, since he ain't ever had Chinese, I didn't think it would go bad. I wasn't paying attention to the moon. He was grouchy and hungry, we finally got to this small park and I set the food down. He was terse wit' his words, jus' wanted to eat. I set the food down in front of him, and asked him to sit. He shot back wit' some comment that he wasn't a dog..."

She wets her tongue with her lips, rubs her hands together, "To which I asked if I needed to start bringing a leash and collar, meaning for it to be a joke, and he went and flipped out on me. Next thing I knew, Fire Claws was on me, he grabbed me, picked me up and threw me down in the grass yelling at me to leave. I landed funny on my shoulder and injured it. He looked like he was about to frenzy, but managed to control himself."

Starla shakes her head, lowering her gaze, "I was scared, scared out of my fucking mind... I couldn't move even if I wanted to leave I was stiff, frozen in place. Fire Claws yelled at me to leave again or he'd kill me. Next thing he had his hands around my throat and was choking me..." she makes the impression of cupping her hands over her throat. "He didn't do it, something happened wit' him and he walked away... some woman came over to help me after he left..."

She shakes her head again, "This I know was my fault. I goaded him when I shouldn't have, was too stupid to not pay attention to what time of the moon it was. I ain't blaming him for what he done, that's all mine. I would've never told anybody about this if it weren't for Milo."

[Sorrow] Kora listens silently, dark eyes steady on the kinswoman as she speaks. When Starla is finished, she glances over at Fire Claws. "Now it's your turn, Fire Claws. Beginning to end."

[Fire Claws] Again the murk of memory seems to haze over what Fire Claws must search out to remember. Even though this even was much more recent and would most likely be recalled easier to many, it is just another part of the miasma of events that floats within the lupus mind. Much more difficult this is as scent is not so apparent to him, smells not like the other. He closes his eyes, hard and tight as he tries to recover the events that led to him bruising the kin. His eyes still closed he speaks.

"Dis 'appen unda Luna' half- face. Ma moon. Tension strong. Went ta eat wit Starla, sum place with strange smellin' food." He could not recall the exact name of the food anymore, it was all the same, this monkey food cooked and prepared with strange combinations of herbs and sauces and other foods. "Sat away from two-legs. Wanted food... she called mah dog. Wolf is no dog... not weak dog. Moon strong. Ever'tin red. Held back urge to kill. Barked. Warned 'er ta leave. Pushed 'er away. Hard. Starla fell... did not leave. Want'ed ta kill. 'eld back. Warn kin again, grabbed her neck to... in...inti..in... errr scare 'er ta go. Still dere. Sought Jarl' 'elp over link. Sorrow~Rhya council mah ta walk away... did so. Barely."

Unlike the first time however, this event seems to have shaken Fire-claws a little more. AS he spoke his fists tightened as he recalled the night, nearly drawing blood from his own palm each time he said the word 'warning.' His teeth grated down on themselves, nearly snarling even though his eyes did not open the whole time.

[Starla] Starla's head snaps up to pin her gaze on Fire Claws, she immediately unfurls her legs to drop her feet onto the ground, hands dropping to curl around the edges of the pew's bench, leaning forward to push off of it. She stands slowly, feet braced for a second, and then Starla is moving away from them.

She gives her back to the group, her arms drawn tightly to fold over her chest, a hand lifted to cover her mouth. She paces to put distance between herself and the Garou; a line of tension burns in the muscles of her back, making her shoulders hunch forward with stiffness and her spine rigid.

[Roman Turner] Starla moved and Roman spoke softly.

"Ya have something to add to that? I can seen the tension in your body. Or is it something else?"

[Sorrow] Roman inquires whether Starla has something to add; Kora listens, quietly to Fire Claws, then turns settles her dark eyes in the kinswoman. Quietly echoing Roman's question, wordlessly.

[Starla] Starla stops; she shakes her head at Roman's question, "Naw," she says back to him, "Ain't got nothing to add."

[Roman Turner] "Ok."

His gaze went to Sorrow, letting her have first words.

[Sorrow] "Starla, I would like to know why you took Fire Claws to eat Chinese food after your experience with him when he was drinking. Second, you said you would never have brought this forward but for Milo. Why is that?"

--

Then, the heavily pregnant Skald - still standing, though by now she has pulled her hands from the pockets of her sweatshirt and slipped them into the front pockets of her jeans. The straight line of her long arms frames the swell of her beach-ball stomach, elbows locked as the too-long, too-wide sleeves slide down her forearms.

"That's twice you've lost control, Fire Claws. How would you judge yourself?"

[Starla] She turns around to look at Kora, pulling her hand from her mouth, "This ain't the first time or the second time, or even the third time me and Fire Claws butt heads. He's snarled at me before on different occasions, the last time was the first time he got too close to losing control."

Starla shrugs, "Roman said not to coddle the Fenrir, I was jus' dumb enough to think maybe I could halp him to understand what humans were like, to halp him socialize better. I thought I had a better understanding of animals than I do people, but maybe him being a Garou tends to misconstrue my way of thinking. Hard to remember the wolf within when ya used to seeing the outer shell of a man. I can't understand why Fire Claws is here in the city if he hates humans so much, if'n he's gonna continue to carry such hate and anger, then why does he stay in the habit of the very thing that destroyed his life before coming here."

[Starla] (appends!!) "I would've jus' buried it and looked the other way."

[Starla] (habit = habitat)

[Sorrow] "It is not my place to judge you, Starla, as you are not my kin. But you would have done no one any favors by burying the incident and pretending it did not happen. Roman has the responsibility and the right to know what happens to you; and Fire Claws is my packmate and my tribe; a Forseti. I have the same responsibility for him. By ignoring the incident, burying it, you allow such weakness to fester.

"That is not the way of the Fenrir, nor is it what our totem expects of us. I know you are a kin. Perhaps you meant it as a kindness. It was no such thing."

[Roman Turner] He wasn't so thrilled with the animal understanding comment, but for the moment let that rest.

"So, trouble between the two of you has been more than the two times we are aware of?"

He sighed, continuing.

"You are not to be alone with Fire Claws. The two of you need to learn from this. I am not forbidding sharing time together, but with another present, preferably a Garou."

[Fire Claws] He does not look up when Starla stands to walk off, he does not need to know what the kin is doing. He looks at Sorrow and ponders what she asks of him. His words now triggered across the link, even as Starla is speaking. His link connects them and he answers his Jarl. There were two possible choices for such actions. Some more demading them others.

~Totemlink~
I have heard of two ways to punish someone. I have heard of those forced into a spiritual quest... to find the land of Unicorn's children and seek the skills of spirits of tranquility and calm for those that are beyond control. Some do not return from such a quest.... there is another punish I have seen.

He pauses as the thought crosses his mind, a punishment he has seen done at his home sept to embarrass another. But it was still a punishment done for the same reason.

~TL~
...I have seen a rite... known to rip the wolf from a true born. Make them without wolf. While without wolf, they are tested... omega to another. If they can learn to control themselves they are given the wolf back. If not they must endure the punishment until they have learned... or die gloriously and without honor.

[Starla] "Ya're right, I'm not a Get of Fenris, I never will be, nor will I ever hold up to their ideas or opinions as I will never understand them or what'cha determine is a weakness."

Starla looks to Roman, narrowing on him for a fraction of a second, she shakes her head at him, "This'll be the last time I will step into Fire Claws' presence, wit' or wit'out Garou. It's better I avoid him all together."

[Sorrow] There's the diminution of Kora's attention, again - that thinning glance as he delivers his recommendations very their shared spiritual connection. Once, her pale brows lift in twin arches over her dark, steady eyes. "When you lost control, Fire Claws, did you shift?"

[Roman Turner] "Never say never Starla. Fate has a way of making fools out of pledges like that."

He stepped towards her his words low.

"With that thought in mind, hear me now. If ya want Simon, if he wants ya, then he can man up and come show he values ya as much as your Tribe does, as much as I do. Until that time, you are not to see him."

[Fire Claws] His answer is quick. Simple

"No."

[Starla] "Bullshit."

She levels her gaze on Roman now, narrowing her eyes as she turns around, arms dropping from her chest to set her hands on her hips, "We're jus' sleeping together - we ain't involved in no relationship. I fuck him the same way I fucked Hunter. The same way I'll fuck any other man: Garou, kin or human. Ya're jus' pissed off because I am sleeping wit' him."

[Roman Turner] "This is my call Starla. Don't demean yourself this way. You can talk to him on the phone, tell him if he is interested, if he wants to challenge for ya, then do so. But the gravy train has stopped. Ya know our issue with him. Have some honor in this matter. Unless ya want to pay a visit back home?"

[Sorrow] "In this, I disagree with you, Fire Claws. Though you lost control, you had the presence of mind to stave off frenzy. As close as you came, you did not give in to the red wave. You will not lose your wolf.

"But you need to learn what it means to be kinfolk; to be two-legged; to live in the city. To that end, you will live for the next half-moon in your homid form. You will not shift. You will eat as a man, live as a man, and face threats as a man. As a kin.

"You will learn how vulnerable our kin are in the face of rage and tooth and claw, because you will live it. And at the end of the fortnight, you will travel to the Battleground realm, and you will find the battle you yourself created there - Fire Claws against Starla - and you will stand in her place; feel both her vulnerability and the paralyzing immediacy of her fear.

"In doing so, you yourself will learn to be strong. You will have to learn the control you require; not from unicorn's children, but from Fenris' own."

[Roman Turner] ((Ok,I have to be up in 5 hrs for work. If you want to continue Starla, let's schedule for it.))

[Starla] She snorts loudly, keeping a narrowed gaze on Roman, "Goodnight, Roman." The kin was done, she steps away from them, moves around the Garou to leave the Church.

[Fire Claws] He looks at Sorrow for a moment, wanting to say something. But holds his tongue on the matter. It was a compromise between the embarrassment that he has seen visited upon one at his home sept and what could have been. He did not like the idea of not having his fur to warm him, nor the claws and fangs to defend or kill as needed. It would not be an easy turn of Luna.

"Yeah Sorrow~ryha."

However it seemed fair. Would he feel fear at such an event? It is unlikely. He still had his rage, his ability to fight. He was not merely claw and teeth.

[Roman Turner] He called after her, following her out. "I"ll take that as ya want me to call home and make arrangements."

And they were gone.

[Roman Turner] ((Thanks guys, I have to sleep))

[Sorrow] There's a lacuna; a pause. The disagreement between Roman and Starla pulls them away from the center of the church, near the transept where the small group had gathered. Kora is still standing, though by now her back has begun to ache. The subtle throbbing that would never have settled into her muscles when she herself was able to shift forms; to allow her body to renew itself.

She glances up once, as Starla flounces out of the church, angry at her cousin's declaration about the limits of her autonomy. Then drops her gaze back to Fire Claws, finds the feral Garou's gaze on her, reads something of his desire to speak in the blunt expression on his feral features. Kora lifts her chin in a subtle upward sweep that settles into a faintly angled cant - the wolf inside her human skin evident in just that moment.

The corners of her generous mouth twist upward, not quiet a smile. Her teeth remind hidden behind her lips. Fire Claws will have to rely on the cues of his eyes as much as his nose in the coming nights. This is just the beginning.

"You look like you have something to say, Fire Claws." - she says, low-voiced, quiet. "What is it?"

[Fire Claws] He paused a moment more, wondering. His eyes turn back on his Jarl. Curious of what was said.

"Aye shal bare da burdin of dis punishment. Bu' mahbe Starla is rite... aye ave no love for da two-legged. Aye handl' wat aye ave too. But aye will not go out mah way to 'elp dem. Save dem. Kill wyrm yeah. But two-legs... dey brough dis on demselves. Nah kin no. But da rest. Aye cam ta kill wyrm... not ta be two-leg kind. Spent mah youth hatin' monkey, wary of two-leg 'fore change... afta change not much different."

[Sorrow] "Have you been up in the belltower?" Kora asks Fire Claws, a slicing, dark-eyed look follows as she lifts her chin toward the doors in the south western corner of the church. Linus barred the rest of the pack from the belltowers, preferring to tend to the ravens that were Hrafn's counterparts on this side himself.

He's gone now.
Kora misses him; an ache behind her breastbone.

His presence little more than peripheral, at the edges of the pack's consciousness these nights.

She pauses long enough for Fire Claws to say: yea or nay, then tells him to "C'mon," and starts off toward the belltower, that awkward human waddle defining her gait, her center of gravity offkilter, her weight too far forward; awkward for it, ungainly as any human woman in late pregnancy would be.

The stairs are worn from years of use, and there's a musty scent in the tower. Bird shit and feathers scattered about here and there. When they get close to the top, a handful of brooding birds take flight - an impression of black wings against the night sky. But just as she knew, there is a view here of the territory; squat and industrial, the city spread out beyond, the weaver's towers gleaming in the south, the office buildings, brilliant, reflective, glowering where they erupt against the horizon, the El tracks and elevated highways looped around the interior like veins and arteries, carrying the lightwaves of late night commuters into or away from nameless destinations. There is the lake to the east, flat and dark, water and sky merging together almost seamlessly at the horizon; and to the west, the city continues unbounded in its outward sprawl.

She's quiet for long minutes, encouraging him to look, to take in the view. At some point, she says, "Big fucking place, isn't it?" A supple twist of her mouth, lost in the shadows.

[Fire Claws] When Kora asks about the belltower it was obvious that he was never up there. Raven's own were tended there, kept by Bone~Writer for the time to ensure that Hrafan's children were tended in the physical as well as the spiritual. He did not venture onto the turf that the spirit talkers took as their own, not lightly. The spiritual ones of the true born tended to bend in strange manners that defied even the most abnormal of two-leg.

He furrowed his brow as she ascends, beckoning him to follow.

It was odd to watch a Jarl of the Get seem to waddle like a penguin in any manner. Even if they held the future of the tribe within their womb it was still something to see. A strange feeling to follow the demands of a leader who could not fight. But then again alpha wolves were central to a pack when they were with cub. Even if the territory was threatened bu another pack.

He does not say a word when offered to look out on the city from such a height. The city spread out further and further than one could image. Much farther than one could see from this level in the air. It was filled with buildings, cement and glass, steel and concrete, blacktop and iron. Where she saw a large city building to life he saw only one thing.

"Da scab seem neva endin'"

[Sorrow] "Pretty much," she says, low-voiced, looking out over the expanse as her attention swings back to the lupus. "And it's teeming with humans, yeah? Every little point of light is another one. Sometimes the Wyrm hides inside them. Sometimes it preys on them. Sometimes it strikes through them, and sometimes - " a supple curve of her mouth, mostly hidden in the shadows.

The reflection of the lights downtown casts a crawling band of light across her cheeks, highlighting the smooth line of her cheekbones, the plain of her temples sweeping up to a high, clear forehead. A half dozen refracted lights gleam across the surface of her eyes when she looks back to him. " - rarely, they fight back against it. If they, collectively, are the authors of anything, I think it's the Weaver's dominance, not the Wyrm's, yeah? But I think that they are the instruments rather than the authors, even then.

"If you were, say, hunting cougars in a forest full of deer and elk, though. Would you ignore the elk and deer? Or would you want to know their ways? How the herds move; how they startle. The noise the bucks make when they sense danger near. The way they stampede when the cougar strikes. All that?"

[Fire Claws] (Are you really that thick not to get the analogy?)
Dice Rolled:[ 2 d10 ] 1, 1 (Botch x 2 at target 6)

[Fire Claws] He looks at her for a second with utter confusion over his face. He couldn't seem to match the words with the meaning by any possible way. He could only think of the situation as it was laid out.

"Wh'ja 'untin cougars?"

[Sorrow] "It's an analogy," she returns, with a quiet huff of an exhalation and a twist of her mouth. "One thing stands for another. In this case: cougars are the Wyrm, the forest is the city, and the deer and elk are humans. You see? If you want to hunt the Wyrm in this habitat - if you want to successfully hunt the wyrm, systematically.

"To track down the big threats to the Caern and the territory on this side and the other - you have to know how the animals in the forest move. How they react. How they look when they are sick, how they look when well. When they will stampede; when they will charge; when they will die."

[Fire Claws] He looked at his Jarl for a moment and then looked out on the city once more. His mind still running with the idea of hunting. His mind trying to put together what was being said. He didn't understand it, how could he.

"In da woods... ya 'unt da elk and da deer. Whe' ya com across dat cougars... yeah deal wit dem. But ya still hunt da elk and deer."

[Sorrow] "I didn't say it was a perfect analogy. Yeah?" She says, shaking her head. "Pretend the cougars are tainted; you aren't hunting for meat and food; you're hunting them as if you would wyrm. Do you understand now?"

[Fire Claws] The wolf born seem intend on just watching the city for the moment, watching the cars move down the streets and avenues that dictate each pathway through the maze of the scab, he watches as lights go out here and there as the city is becoming more and more sleepy. He watches and ponders what he would do if he were hunting wyrm. These humans were instruments of the wyrm.

"Aye see"

He watched the city as the two-legs slept and he pondered what new horrors the wyrm would use them for. What torments Gaia would suffer due to these instruments.

"Ya watch the prey to betta undastand da otha predators."

[Sorrow] "Exactly," Kora returns, a quiet, sweeping look back out to the city. A supple note of approval in her eyes and voice. "You have to take the time to understand them if you want to hunt effectively among them.

"If you just want to through yourself forward into glory," a twist of her shoulders, narrow for her tall frame, swallowed by the fabric of her sweatshirt. " - well, there are a half-hundred deadly battles within reach, yeah? But you want more than that, I think. You don't just want to kill Wyrm, you want to do so effectively. It's what Hermodr expects of us, too.

"You can't kill all of them; and underneath, some of them are more on our side than the Unmaker's. Not enough, to be sure. But some." Then she cuts a glance away from the horizon, dark eyes settling on Fire Claws. "I'm not suggesting that you go out of your way to protect them, mind you. On some level, it they need protection - if they've seen some manifestation of the Wyrm, or a Garou in warform, they are already compromised. Broken. Bleeding, and you have to root them out for their own good, or kill them to protect the veil."

Pitiless in this, the Skald.

"But your hate is wasted on them; this is their habitat, and to hunt here, you have to know how they move."

Immoderate.

[Starla] "Can't see why ya jus' don't hustle up some money from like the tribe or some of yar richer kin. Don't they have money here in the city?"

August mentions the heat's out, it perks the ears of the dusky-skinned girl that was fussing with an air mattress. She seems to get it up on two church benches that she's slung together for a makeshift bed, her blanket falling off her shoulders with a colorful swear of words.

"Whole gaggle of people live here, Miss." her nose crinkles at the sight of the carrier, "Izzat a baby?"

[Roman Turner] His ears turned red first and heat rushed up from his neck turning the mottled burn scars there a deep purple with Starla's question. Immediately his attention went back to August and the baby carrier.

"Mother of God, it's a wonder y'all didn't freeze. Ya should of called me. I'm pretty sure I made sure to give ya my number on a napkin that one night in that cafe with Miss Rain. And yessum, Miss Kora is my Alpha, she lives here most of the time."

He ushered August and child closer to the fire and Starla.

"Miss August, this is Miss Starla, she's a cousin. Miss Starla, this here is Miss August and her baby girl. She's family."

He gathered a couple of blankets with every intention of wrapping mother and child up like mummies.

"Come warm up. Ya can stay here. It ain't fancy, but it's warmer than no heat."

[Miss August] "I didn't know where else to go.. " She muttered as she wandered closer to the fire and eventually set the baby carrier down.

"I don't believe I got your number that night Mr. Turner.. all I recall getting was a strong tongue lashing about how I was an ugly person inside." A beat as she began to unwrap. Her gaze for sure didn't meet his. "I do want to apologize for that evening.. and for everything else that I've done which has caused my family to distrust or dislike me. I want all that nastiness behind us and I hope you can forgive me."

[Miss August] Hazel eyes flicked over to Starla. She smiled a greeting as well as nodded in response to the question about the baby.

[Starla] She plucks at the braid hanging over her shoulder, pale green eyes set in the round features of her bronze face dart between Roman and then back to August, slipping down to stare at the bundle in the carrier. She scrunches up her nose again, her expression growing confused.

"Ya lugged a baby all the way in this snow? Why ain'tcha leave'em wit' ya man?"

[Roman Turner] For a moment his face went completely blank and then he was turning away to tend the fire, hiding his expression. When he spoke it was as neutrally gentle as he could make it.

"Give me your phone and I will put the number in. You are more than welcome to stay, you and the child. Going out in this is sure to cause all your deaths. As for the rest. We live and learn, or so they say. So let's live and learn."

Starla asked her question and he just wished the ground would open and and swallow him whole. Holy Mary Mother of God, the proverbial can was opened and the worms were rushing to come out.

"Her power is out. And the rest is, well I'll let Miss August tell those tales."

[Miss August] "I don't have one, Miss Starla. Bringing the baby with to the heat was the best plan I could come up with for the evening." August carefully began to pull the layers of blankets off of the baby until the light skinned, red haired and hazel eyed infant was staring back up at her, sucking on a fist.

The blonde kin was NOT about to open up that can of worms any further than to simply state there wasn't one. No one ever needed to hear her story again as far as she was concerned. They could make it up for all it really mattered. Maybe their versions would be better.

"The fire feels wonderful, thank you." She offered a soft smile to Roman (back turned or no), cheeks still rosy from the cold.

[Kora] The steps leading up to the church are lumpen with snow, poorly defined except by the patterns of footsteps in the rising mound. Someone's made an effort at shoveling out a path. Someone else went sledding down the unshoveled steps. That's where Kora walks, firmly bundled against the arctic chill, the collar of her wool coat pulled up, her hood over her hair, scarf wrapped around her mouth and chin, hands firmly in her pockets. Snowcoats her boots and higher; her jeans are damp to the thigh from it. The door swings open behind August and there is another abominable snowperson, stamping snow from her boots into the puddle of snowmelt just inside the front door.

Kora does not start shivering until the subtle gradation of temperature hits her. It's too cold outside to shiver, but now that she's thawing out, she allows herself one long shudder, a sharp exhale before she masters herself and starts taking off her winter things. "Roman, Starla, August - " her cold-thinned voice, quiet greetings as she unwraps the scarf. "everything okay?"

[Roman Turner] "Miss August's power went out. She and the baby have come for shelter and I offered hospitality."

He was never so glad to see anyone in his life. Though he couldn't resist asking with the snow covering most of Kora.

"That Yeti snow Ninja didn't get hold of ya, did he?"

[Starla] "Pfft. I done heard ya twice, I git it."

She clucks her tongue against the roof of her mouth, flashing Roman a cheeky grin, "Always was the nice one."

She bends down to sweep up the fallen blanket, tucking it back around her before moving off to gather up the bedding she and Roman scrounged up earlier, and tosses it on the air mattress.

[Miss August] "Hello Miss Kora.. " August sat down on the pew and scooped the baby up. "I hope it's alright that Mr. Turner offered me a place to stay... I don't have any heat.. and I'd caught rumors that you were staying here.."

[Kora] "Just one of those snow blower's the city's been running to clear the main streets," Kora says, a faint twist of her mouth for Roman. "You're welcome here, August." A brief glance up, at the roof, the broken rafters, then back down at the baby. "Though it might not be too comfortable for long for your babe, with Garou in and out. If your power doesn't come back on soon, we'll put you up with Drew, I think." A brief glance at Roman, then August, "This is Roman's home, too, yeah? It's fine. The kitchen's through the door by the chancel, that's where the rest of the rooms are. There's food there, milk and cold stew, a few other things.

"Roman, make sure to give August a room away from the Garou's dens. And put a heater in her room. If we don't have extra mattresses, she can have mine, yeah?"

[Roman Turner] "I got a couple extra air mattresses today. And if ya don't mind Miss August, I am sure Miss Rain would share her room with ya. Or ya can have mine. I been staying out here anyway. I'll make sure ya have heat and show ya where the bathroom is. We're a little primitive but we make up for it with hospitality."

[Miss August] "Oh.. no.. I couldn't do that. You keep your mattress.. you need it, Kora. I'll be fine. I have a few blankets," namely the ones she had over the baby carrier and then whatever was stuffed into her bag. "I'll be fine. A heater is more than sufficent if you have one to spare.."

She patted the babes back as it cooed. "She doesn't mind the rage all that much - just gets this fussy pants look. I live with a Garou - but he's out of town for a bit.. so she's pretty used to it.. at least in small doses.."

"Please don't fuss over us. We're fine. Just a corner to stay in is more than a enough. We'll try to keep out of ya'lls hair as much as possible."

[Starla] By the looks of the makeshift bed Starla was making out of pews and the air mattress, she seems to prefer this area as well. She shuffles her feet, winter boots that she hasn't taken off since she got there stamping down the ground. She listens to them talk, arching an eyebrow every now and then.

[Roman Turner] "Ya get a room to yourself and some privacy for when ya need it. Ya don't want someone ogling ya when ya feed the baby or nothing. Besides, it will be warmer when ya sleep. Though I'm not saying ya have to go hide in the room or nothing."

He was quick to add that last part.

"We got blankets, Mr. Trent brought more lastnight. And we got some sleeping bags. No need to do without in this Pack."

[Starla] "Ah don't think ah'e ever seen anyone look a gift horse in the mouth and reject it."

Starla shakes her head, clucking her tongue against the roof of her mouth again, watching Roman do his best to provide and fuss over August and her baby. She sits down on the pews, pulling her legs up underneath the blanket and settles it around herself, pulling it up over her head like a robe.

[Kora] Make sure she has what she needs. Kora tells Roman, low-voiced. If she needs a long-term place, we'll put her up with Drew.

"There's plenty of room, August." A supple twist of her mouth, lifting her chin toward the old social hall attached to the church. "More rooms than I can count back there; it's not a fuss. We take hospitality seriously among the Fenrir. It's the old way; northern climates demand that sort of give and take." For the second time in two nights, Kora quotes a passage from the Eddas.

"Fire is needed by the newcomer
Whose knees are frozen numb;
Meat and clean linen a man needs
Who has fared across the fells,

Water, too, that he may wash before eating,
Handclothes and a hearty welcome,
Courteous words, then courteous silence
That he may tell his tale.
"

"Beer's in the coolers if you want it, milk and soda in the kitchen. What's here is yours. Now," a brief pause, as she unbuttons her coat, strips off the outer garments down to her dedicated things. "I need to go see if Linus got that murder of Hrafn flying." One she's stripped off her coat, gloves, hoodie and scarf, Kora fishes a small mirror from her pocket.

One minute she's there; then next she's gone, stepping across the barrier between worlds.

[Kora] (aaand, must sleep! thanks for the scene. :) )

[Kora] get your transcript!
to Kora
[Rain McKellar] Rain's arms are crossed low over her middle. Her expression is somewhat anxious, but when she looks up to August as the other Gaian speaks it is with as much support as she can muster in this tense environment.

[Carter Roth] Carter frowns deeply at Balance Without Faults words and he shakes his head, an angry look flitting behind his eyes.

[Balance Without Fault] -- and the eightball comes back to Balance.

"I'm sorry to hear you've been so ill-used by your former mate, August. Tell us the name of this Garou so that we all know his dishonor."

The eightball goes back to August.

[Dibs list is currently: August, Matthieu, Danicka, Delilah.]

[August Grant] "Paul Kellogg. He seems to have .. left.." She'd rather use the word fled.. "the city." And once again, the eight ball is passed on.

[Bridget Geroux] Bridget stands at the doorway, listening to the conversation while munching on part of a sandwich. The tightness to her muscles and the smirk on her face expresses her discontent with the line of conversation. She takes a glass of ice water over to Carter and leans against his side. She offers the frigid beverage to the other kin, the corners of her mouth turning in a slight smile, an expression that simply says: here.

[Kora] Kora listens as Rain says her piece; her arms tighten when Balance Without Fault directs her to see to Izzy's complaint. The look she gives the Grand Elder is direct, her expression ironic, but not wry. When Carter speaks, the heavily pregnant Fenrir audibly rolls her eyes (seriously, Nash can [i]hear/i] it). She flashes him a look when he speaks up. Except for the obvious tension, the expression is quiet, animal, unreadable.

[Starla Navarro] Starla clucks her tongue against the roof of her mouth, shaking her head. She looks over her should at Kora, catching the eye-rolling expression of the Jarl. She turns back in her seat, shifting closer to Rain and draws a comforting arm around the kin's shoulders, hugging her.

[Jackson Montgomery] [[Add Jackson in after Delilah]]

[Derek Anderson] Derek listened, standing near Rain, August and Jackson. He owuld have loved to stand with people from his tribe but Sasha and Katherine weren't there, Gabriel wasn't invited and he didn't rally knewMatthieu except glimpsing at him at the loft the other night.

He looked relax, hands in his pockets. He had nothing to say about all this really. He has been well treated by his Tribe, other Garou and kinfolks he has met. Well Remy was a jerk but even then, it went pretty ok when he met him. He knew some people had problems with Garou, that some had bad experiences in the past. He wasn't one of them. Maybe it'll come, maybe he'll be like Izzy or maybe not. But for now, his life was good.Maybe he didn't need much, or maybe it was his upbringing, butr he was..ok with the way things were.

[Joey] When the meeting first came to order, Joey sat looking slightly away from the circle, her head moving nearly imperceptibly to the beat of some rhythm in her head. As soon as the eight ball started going around, though, her attention was on the people in the room, her dark eyes moving from speaker to speaker. For the most part, she just watches, listening attentively. She's silent, even when Izzy speaks up about her punishment, though there's a tension to her brow, a slight downward turn to the corners of her mouth. The frown doesn't leave her face, in fact worsens, especially when August speaks up, the kinswoman so obviously pregnant. Joey knew her mate, knew him for the filthy son of a bitch he could be, and not for the wisdom he supposedly held in the Nation. The fact that he would abandon his mate was hardly surprising to her, but infuriating. Wasn't August the girl he'd once mistaken Joey for? What a prick.

[Carter Roth] Carter takes that glass with a nod to Bridget as great a thanks as he could give at the moment, and sips it, still looking displeased but for now...silent.

[Matthieu] When the 8ball comes his way he stands in his usual regal posture before kin as well as his peers. He takes the time to acknowledge all who choose to look at him with a smile before speaking up and addressing the others present.

"I hear kin speaking about unity, and about working together and about organization. So allow me to speak up and please do hear what I have to say."

"Harrier's Grace was founded under the idea that the Mortal world is an important one which we garou have little direct grasp upon. In the heart of a city as large as Chicago we stand in an awkward position where mundane threats could see us utterly destroyed without the means to address them."

He takes the time to look over faces one by one.

"You wish to take part in the nation. You wish to take an active role in the pursuits of your own people then now is your chance. Harrier's Grace was founded specifically with the Kin in mind and with time and your assistance we should like to see that all are both cared for, as well as allowed to take an active role in this nation's happenings. We need eyes and ears, additionally we need faces and talented minds."

"The Mundane World is your world and if "We" the Garou are to control it we need our kin to stand with it. So any who stand ready to take an active role in a pack who will share in it's endeavours with all Garou and Kin who take part please step forth after this meeting."He smiles a little to everyone present.

"I do not wish this to be a recruiting event for a pack but what I am hearing is that Kin would like a chance to take a more active role in their society. This is what Harrier's Grace was formed with the intention of seeing through. So it remains relevant to the situation."

He then looks around at the others involved.

"We are one nation, we cannot exist without the whole of that nation working in unison. Our kin are our support network, our homes, and our families. Whatever one feels of their unique and individual position within this nation know now that we are not oblivious to the plight of our kin. We live and die with the hope that our people will remember us and more than anything our people are our kin."

"Perhaps we do not always show the proper deference or respect but we have a very difficult job."He then turns his attention to Izzy."When our kin stand and denounce us as if we have somehow broken some sacred vow it comes as a potent and dangerous blow. There are warriors in their graves at this very moment who have died defending the kin of this sept. I also promise you right now that if you were in danger there are at least one or two garou in this room alone who would stupidly rush off to their own deaths in order to rescue you. Remember this when you find yourself doubing the importance our kin hold to us."

"In the end we ask of our kin nothing more or less than we ask of ourselves."He says with a hint of a smile back at the kin."In the end we must all stand ready to give everything for this nation if that is what we must. That cannot be negociated it simply must be."

[Balance Without Fault] [Current dibs list: Danicka, Delilah, Jackson]

[Kora] (dibs!)

[Balance Without Fault] [and for the record - applying a -2 honor hit to Paul's sheet for getting publicly denounced before auspice and tribal councils, plus half the city's kin, reduced him to subcliath status. normally i wouldn't announce minor renown tweaks, but in this case it's a fairly substantial change in how other chars would perceive him.]

[Balance Without Fault] [...if, y'know, the char ever gets reactivated *LOL*]

[Balance Without Fault] [last OOC note! if your character holds precedence and wants to use it, make a note in your dibs-calling so i don't have to ask individually!]

[Danicka Musil] [I'm almost there! Sorry for the wait!]

[Danicka Musil] It's as though she had mental notes. Danicka gets the 8-ball after the Galliard Elder and speaks up. Directly, in fact, to Carter Roth.

"I know what you can do," she says plainly, and simply. Maybe even gently, though her voice is levelled directly at him in public. "I also know, and I am the only person currently in this room who knows as well as you do, what it means to be raised as a Kin of Thunder.

"The Garou will never see you as their equal. You may be able to heal with a touch, but you will never be able to fight as well as they can. You will never know what it is like to enter a new body and hunt on all fours. You cannot cross between worlds at will. You will never share a full measure of their power, and so you will never be seen as their equal." She pauses a moment. "You say you will not work for the Nation without equality. You will never get it. And in this way -- knowing what the stakes are, knowing what we all stand to lose -- you are more selfish and dishonorable than any Kinfolk in this room.

"Even in human government, if you ally insults you and will not yield, will not compromise, those alliances end, often bloodily. So too will your connection to the Garou you want to treat you as an equal. Work with them or work alone, but do not get in their way or you will be cut down. We aren't fools, Mr. Roth, not raised in our tribe. Amunet is trying to find a way to decrease our marginalization. And if you want to be involved, at some point you will have to submit to another's leadership -- and it might be Kin, but ultimately it will be to the Garou. Suck it up or get out of the way."

A pause. She looks at Amunet. "You do guard the alliance jealously, Amunet. Bridget is right about that. You seemed secretive even to me, when I tried to show you nothing but support and interest. You need to work on that attitude, or all your efforts are going to be in vain. When you come to this meeting and then break the rules, you don't show yourself as a very good leader for Kinfolk, much less someone the Garou might listen to. I want this to work. By god, believe me, I want this to work. But the Kinfolk have to grow up. We all have suffered, but not a thing is going to get done til we all get over it for the sake of the greater good. And those of you who can't do that, whose angst and baggage is too much to let go of, I don't even know why you bothered to show up."

She takes a deep breath and exhales it slowly. "The last attempt at a coalition of kinfolk failed because the Kin involved wanted it to be some kind of perfectly equal democracy, and that will. Not. Work. Even Garou have to follow orders they don't agree with sometimes. We do too, if we want to be of any real use at all."

[Balance Without Fault] [delilah, jackson, kora, and then BWF is retaking the ball!]

[Kora] (drop Kora from the list, pls!)

[Carter Roth] Carter meets Danika's gaze and he shakes his head at the woman. Before flipping her the bird, he might not have the 8 ball, so he won't speak, but the message is clear enough.

[Delilah Marciano] When the 8 ball finds its way into the Glass Walker's hands, she holds it up, gives it a good hard shake. She stares at the rubber triangle for a second; the curve of her generous mouth etches into a thinly veiled frown.

"Will this end well?" Delilah asks the ball, "Maybe."

She turns her eyes up to meet the Grand Elder's gaze for second, tilting her head to watch the rest of the room. "This, esteemed rhya, is the breeding ground for the discontent. You ask us for our opinions, you tell us to lay our grievances out into the open, so that we may be heard, so we may have a voice..."

A beat, her body shifts, rolls the plastic ball between her hands, "What is this all for? To what purpose will listening to our bitching serve you, in your judgment of us? They are unhappy, they expressed this, and yet, it will not change. We all know this - you said it yourself, it's not a democracy."

She shakes her head slowly, "Amunet is trying to organize an alliance, it has been said by Ms. Musil, it will not work. There is no organization, this is like trying to herd cats, they won't cooperate without first laying a foundation. Training kinfolk in self-defense and first-aid will do very little against a monster breathing down their necks. If the Wyrm wants to kill us, it will do so."

"The best efforts of the kin, if they wish to come together and organize, is to take a step away from the front lines, and work behind the scenes as we are meant to do. With our mortal influences, our skills, and our connections. We are the first line of defense in covering up the messes that the Garou like to make in the mundane world."

With that, she shrugs her shoulders and hands the ball off to the next person that so desires it.

[Kora] (change my mind still keeping dibs!)

[Danicka Musil] Carter flips Danicka off. She shrugs at him and gestures to Danny that she'd like an ice water.

[Balance Without Fault] [bwf takes the ball!]

[Izzy Montoya] She looks around and finally grabs a glass of ice water, and taps her ashes into it. It'll do for now. It also serves to keep her expression hidden for a moment.

It's likely a good thing.

[Sarita Ecos de la Risa] [[Did he cut or did I lose my turn? :) ]]

[Holden] [cutteR!]

[Balance Without Fault] [he totally cut.]

"First and last strike for you, Mr. Roth."

Then, to Delilah:

"I was actually about to address that. I've got a few things on my agenda tonight, and we're still on number one. I'd like to hear specific concerns from kin first and settle them as I can -- so frankly, Garou and kin of Maelstrom, we're starting to get a little off topic with all the philosophy.

"After that, I've got two incidents I want to go over. After that, I want to discuss and settle certain issues with the coalition itself.

"Let's get back to the kin. Specific concerns, bring them forth."

-- and on to Jackson.

[Gina McClaren] *Gina's heard enough, and she who had a voice designed - accent and all - for other's pleasure in her speaking - had nothing nice to say. So like her sweet pikey mother had told her with a rap of knuckles across teeth -

"Effen ye've naethen nice tae say, fer christs sakes jes shut yer fookin crumbhole."

She moves towards the kitchens, bumping past the folk in the door with a low sung "Oot the road please" - before moving to fuss with the food there, warming what had grown cold, cooling what had grown warm . Taking a hefty slug from a dented flask drawn deep from the V of dark cleavage. Liquor finally offered to Bridget and Carter in turn.*

[Carter Roth] Carter grimaces at Balance without Fault and shakes his head at the man, he does not however flip the man the bird. He simply looks to Bridget who was standing by his side looked back to Balance, and dropped his water letting it clatter to the floor loudly, maybe even shatter. He looked around at his fellow kinsman, all who had come here with the understanding that they would be free to speak...obviously that was not the case.

Before he turned and walked out a brief nod given to Gina and her alcohol.

[Sarita Ecos de la Risa] He takes the 8-Ball with a respectful nod. Yes, he is a good kin. Mostly.

"I had one more concern to bring up, Rhyas. It seems like...and I don't think this is an endemic issue, but I've seen it a couple times now...some Garou try to instruct kin who...well, really shouldn't be. And I know people may wonder what right I have to say that. But I grew up in a family that was blessed. Both of my siblings were Garou. My father was an Ahroun. I like to think I know a fair amount, though not everything, about certain matters. I won't give a ton of examples...but one I specifically recall is that a kin, new to our city and rather wet behind the ears, was witness to a Thrall frenzy that took place here. I was present and got the kin to safety...after I left, said kin was told by a Garou that in case of a frenzy, playing dead was a good idea. As if a Garou who was in frenzy, especially Thrall frenzy, would just leave them alone if they were lying prone and pretending to be dead."

He pauses, trying to figure out how to word this without seeming disrespectful. "To be honest, I was dumbstruck when the kin told me this. It's...really bad advice, to say the least. I've passed it on to Roman, who has passed it further on...but it seems like some Garou could use some kind of instruction themselves before they're taking kinfolk under their responsibility."

He hands it back to Balances-Without-Fault.

[Sarita Ecos de la Risa] [[Oh fuck. You know who that was supposed to be. :P ]]

[Danicka Musil] [*points and laughs at samael*]

[Nash] [I for one am proud of Sarita and wish him all the best.]

[Sarita Ecos de la Risa] [[I'm working and shit and it was bound to happen eventually AND LEMME ALONE! *mock cries and runs away* Okay nah, it's funny, ngl]]

[Balance Without Fault] Over behind the bar, Danny suddenly blurts out a cough that sounds suspiciously like a laugh. He claps his hand over his mouth and holds up the other. "I know, Mr. Balance. First and last warning. Sorry." And he mimes the zipping of his mouth.

Balance, for his part, takes the ball and answers Jackson directly. "Do you or does anyone know the name of this Garou?"

The ball goes back to Jackson.

[Quinn] So far, Quinn hasn't had anything to bring up, no concerns or grievances to air. For the most part, she keeps out of the way, helping where she can but generally staying under the radar. But when someone says the advice given in times of Thrall was to "play dead," her blue eyes widen, then her fine dark brows constrict.

When she rises, it's not to intercept that passage of the eight ball. It's to raise a brow at Carter Roth, the look simply How rude, trail briefly in his wake, and bend to retrieve the fallen glass of water. She gestures to Danny to bring a towel or something to clean up the water.

[Bridget Geroux] Bridget writes something on a napkin and tucks it into Carter's hand before he decides to shatter his glass all over the floor and make his way out. She stifles a tiny laugh-- it's not at all audible and she turns her face in Danny's direction so she doesn't disturb the conversation-- but it's there.

Gina thankfully offers up some booze, which the Stag kin thankfully takes so she can stifle her grin and shut the fuck up.

[Jackson Montgomery] He takes the ball and seems hesitant to name names at the moment. The information was passed along, but he was given a request. "Kristen. She's a Fianna Theurge who stays here at the Brotherhood...I don't know her last name or her deed name." Handed back.

[Kieran Mondblume] *His eyes widen at that, and he looks back and forth. He frowns, clearly pondering.*

[Balance Without Fault] "Jenny," Balance speaks directly to the woman watching quietly from over by the kitchen door, "can you get a message to Kristen? Let her know a Thralled Homid would sooner munch a dead body than ignore it, and that maybe she shouldn't run around teaching the kin for a while.

"Unfortunately," this is to all, "Garou rarely have time these days to be fully trained before stepping out into the world as Cliaths. The war's too desperate, and we need soldiers. The downside is occasionally we get a good soldier whose education has been a little lacking in certain non-essential regards.

"There's really no way prevent these things from happening. I can't publish a manual of Everything You Should and Shouldn't Say To Kin. All we can do is troubleshoot one incident at a time, so I appreciate your bringing this up."

And the ball goes to Kora.

[Danicka Musil] There's a glance from Shadow Lord Kinswoman to Shadow Lord Elder when Carter leaves. It's hard to read, for those that don't know her -- for those that are, at the moment, invested in other conversations. He might understand. He might not, even as well as he knows her.

Danicka sips her ice water, and waits for the next blowup.

[Gina McClaren] *Gina's expression at the breaking of glass is one of frank annoyance. She stands in the kitchen in her barefeet, and hisses irritation. Singing lowly to bridget - yes.. without the 8-ball.*

Trade ye tha sip o' firewater fer yer gi'en tha broom, Bridget darlin. Dinnae fancy me bloody feet on account o' foolishness, aye?

[Balance Without Fault] [wait, is Kristen there? i see her logged in. i know patrick's the fianna alpha, but jacqui ain't here tonight. well, if Kristen's here, BWF would speak directly to her.]

[Balance Without Fault] Danny, meanwhile, is hurrying over with dustpan and broom. He shakes his head mutely at Gina and Bridget, forefinger to lips, waving them off. The message is clear: I got it!

[Kristen Burke] ((I was told that Kristen was not allowed to be here As such she has not tried to speak or rebut what was said about her.))

[Bridget Geroux] Bridget moves to action, sets her glass down on the bar, and helps pick up Carter's mess despite her amusement. It's alright, the movement gives her something to do. She shakes her head at Danny and helps him anyway.

[Balance Without Fault] [OK, I just saw Jacqui sign on, so I guess Kristen wouldn't be there after all. Assume Jenny sends her a polite note repeating what BWF said, only a lot nicer and reflexively-apologetic!]

[Gina McClaren] *Gina remains in place. You know. So as not to step in glass with the bare feet. But Danny gives her the shush and she raises an eyebrow in a clear expression of "Oh Enough." An incredulous shake of her head mirroring the Fianna's.*

[Quinn] Quinn's gotten most of the bigger chunks gathered carefully into one hand. When Danny arrives with dustpan and broom, she smiles warmly and rises to carry her burden to the nearest trash bin, which happens to be in the kitchen. When she comes back out again, she weaves around the outside of the circle to return to her seat.

[Kora] There's something - implicitly feral about the heavily pregnant Garou tonight. She's standing, not sitting. She should sit. Some of the people tonight are long winded - not telling stories, not remembering deeds, not discussing the dead - just talking.

Those closest to her can feel her restlessness like ozone in the air around her. It does not take much to bring it forward these nights, careful as she has to be now, pregnant as she is. Alone here tonight, her brother - her Godi - gone, her beta in another Sept, seeking his own tribe for challenge.

By the time the eight-ball comes her way, Carter is gone. Her dark eyes follow his path through the room; she catches the scribbing Bridget does on a napkin, watches until the kinsman has left the restaurant.

The creature's generous mouth flattens then. Whatever she meant to say is distilled down to this: "I have kept my territory open to all tribes, Garou certainly, kin more so. It's unreasonable to expect you to live in a city and somehow keep track of our changing, Balkanized territory. But, Wyrmbreaker-rhya, that man is barred from mine. I trust you will pass it on to him."

[Kieran Mondblume] [Dibs?]

[Balance Without Fault] [back to BWF, then Kieran!]

[Honor's Compass] Katherine and Patrick both here, somewhere, and their player is very apologetic for being tardy! She suggests Katherine is looking very pretty in white standing somewhere near pack-mates and as well as Balance Without Fault and Patrick is over yonder possibly looking confused -- also in a very pretty way, albiet more masculine -- or simply bored.

Carry on!

[Adamidas] She opens her mouth, then closes it. Her attention seems to be intent on what is going on, and before she can really say anything, the Fury turns her head in the direction of... something. Slightly to the left. She gives the Grand Elder a look and taps her chest with two index fingers, then gestures behind her with her thumb.

Whatever that look says, it must be important. If given the okay, she slips out as quickly as she enters. Just as understated, and punctuated with a pop.

[Balance Without Fault] Though Carter's departure didn't provoke an immediate response from the Garou named for his balance, it's remarked on when the ball comes back into his possession.

"Wyrmbreaker, your kinsman disrespected this gathering again with his dramatic departure. See to it. And let him know that his antics only resulted in the very kin he professes to champion scrambling to clean up his mess."

He nods to Adamidas, then, before continuing.

"At this point I'm going to make a last call for kin to bring forward their concerns. If there's nothing else, we're moving on."

[on to Kieran! and if there are any more kin concerns, call dibs now cuz BWF is about to move things along]

[Quinn] [dibs because I gotta get something out in case I have to bail before the end!]

[Wyrmbreaker] Wyrmbreaker nods mutely to Kora and and Balance, the second nod deeper than the first. Then he gets up, leaning over to murmur briefly to Danicka before excusing himself from the gathering.

[Kieran Mondblume] *He pushes up, and then he takes the eight ball, shaking it idly.* Clearly, if he's getting pissed off enough to drop a glass onto the ground and leave, something screwed up happened to him in the past. I think that's part of the problem. We can't fix these problems without years and years of therapy that we don't have time for.

*He tosses the eight ball to his other hand.* But I will say, I've noticed every kin has their skills and talents. I don't think I'm alone in saying, I'd like to hear about those instead.

[Quinn] The tall Fiann has retaken her seat now. It should be noted that she's wearing clothes, and they're probably pretty nice, and probably includes a shirt with the sleeves rolled up to reveal the tattoo on her right arm. Nothing fancy, just some cool looking birds.

Anyway!

She sits up a little straighter when there seems to be a lull, lifts her chin, and indicates she'd like the magic eight ball next. When it comes to her, Quinn doesn't shake it to read her fortune, though she does smile a little down at it before standing to address the assembled.

"Hello," she says, her voice warm, and still carries a touch of a Baltimore accent. "I'm Quinn, I own The Winchester tavern up in Lake View. Some of you might've heard of it. Like The Brotherhood, we've only got kin on staff, so it's a safe place. If any of you are in the area and find yourself in need of a place to rest or otherwise recuperate for a while, the doors are open. To Kin and Garou alike." After that, she rolls the ball from one hand to the other, says, "That's it," and passes it down the line rather than tossing it to the grand elder.

[Nash] The Jarl is understandably restless. On this side of the bar, the Fenrir are all standing; Nash looks like he probably ought to sit down, but for the moment, he's still on his feet, his right arm held up against his midsection while bruised eyes watch the proceedings--silently, now that that first [and last] outburst is over with.

There is a lot going on, between Strider and Lord Kinfolk slamming out and slamming glasses. Nash, unlike many others, doesn't have to stifle laughter. He glances around, then finds a place to rest his eyes when Kora starts to speak. He looks back at her when the Uktena speaks, as if looking for something, but he doesn't lean over to whisper or anything else that might be considered disruptive.

[Delilah Marciano] Delilah sighs; she steps away from the table glancing around at the assembly one final time. She has heard enough, and the Grand Elder has yet to get beyond the first line of questioning. She turns away, slipping off in silence towards the back entrance of the Brotherhood' hand retrieves her phone, texting her driver to come around to the back side to pick her up as she left the meeting.

[Kora] There's something about the way Kora handled the eight-ball. Held it as if it were a cracked bone, as if there were marrow in it - rather than likely toxic water locked behind a window with catchy sayings on a plastic weighted die by children chained to extruding machines in some unlikely backwater of Guangdong province, China.

That sense of animal lingers around her. Her hair is pale, fine-stranded, her skin equally pale, winter-thing, dark eyes set above sharp cheeks made softer by the extra weight of advanced pregnancy. No matter: the wolf is still visible underneath. As now. Nash glances at her, and she lifts her chin, canting her head, dark eyes finding his with an unerring sort of grace. She holds the look for a quiet moment, then glances away.

[Balance Without Fault] The eightball comes back to Balance eventually, passed hand to hand until someone loses patience and tosses it. Catching it neatly, the Grand Elder takes a drink of water before going on.

"Let's discuss that in a minute, Kieran, when we talk about the coalition some more. I have two incidents I want to go over. Unfortunately, Amunet, they both involve you.

"First up: the Brotherhood defense plans were posted up a couple of weeks ago, and you seemed to have something to say about it. Jenny mentioned you removed the original posting as something of an act of protest." Over by the kitchen, Jenny looks mildly mortified. "What was that about, and has that been settled?"

[Amunet Knezevic] "It was less an act of protest than an act of frustration, Rhya. Again, the perception of being dictated to, rather than being acknowledged as being willing to work together. I apologize for my rash decision, and hope that my actions will not reflect poorly on those who can be held responsible for me."

Her fingers run in her hair, eyes flickering away before meeting BWF's once more. "It has been offered that there be a meeting with myself and those charged with the safety of the Brotherhood. I believe it is just a matter of finding a convenient time for everyone, and then the matter should be settled."

[Danicka Musil] [Dibs!]

[Gina McClaren] *Her flask of corn liquor is reclaimed and settled back in her assets as she steps aside for the exiting Glasswalker kin. Strider kin maneuvering her way out of the kitchen with an eye to the floor, wary for any invisible shards lying in wait for small burnished feet. The kin moves to stand between Leon and Matt, dwarfed by a good foot or more by each. Curvy kin's body language filling in the gaps where verbal communication was not allowed. She leans on Mirror's whisper, floury skirt no doubt soiling his perfectly pressed suit. A painted toe prods Hostile Takeover's knee, accompanied by a wry smile and a roll of eyes. Familiarity and Affection for both, mingled with no small exasperation at the proceedings. Her attention shifts to those speaking.*

[Honor's Compass] [Kate has something to add! How do I -- *hits the buzzer*]

[Danicka Musil] [Danicka yields to the ranked Garou present *gavel*]

[Wyrmbreaker] [dibs order is Kate, Danicka, then probably BWF.]

[Sarita Ecos de la Risa] Sarita doesn't fail to notice Gina's brief interaction, such as it is, with Leon. Her eyes narrow a little bit, watching them, and anyone paying attention to her would notice a bit of bristling. She doesn't speak out, merely watches for a long moment before looking back.

Yeah. She'll be dealing with that later.

[Matthieu] Matthieu made certain to follow the kin across the floor. Whether Gina knew it or not those eyes followed her quietly. She drew closer and closer and even took the chance to squeeze herself between he and his beta. A slight smile grew and he peeked up at the woman with a hint of a smile. She had likely been drinking and was feeling pleasant. Which was surprisingly okay with the Garou who looked up at her with familiar eyes.

He didn't speak however, simply welcomed her to join if she pleased.

[Leon Davenport] Finally something interesting happening to this meeting And no it's not an angry kin storming out or incidents involving one with the Broho'splan or anything else. No, it's the presence of a beautiful caramel skinned Strider kin, moving between him and his Alpha.

Shelean into Matt and that makes him smile, a genuine rare one from the Ahroun these days. Then she prds hm and the smile grew wider. He kept hi hands in his pants pockets, his smile turning into a grin. Then his piercing blue eyes were back on the meeting

There has been no GW kin here that he knew of. After all he knew Delilah only by her GWnet handle. He didn't want any of his tribe's kin getting into troubel tonight. He seem ot have had his wish granted.

[Kieran Mondblume] *His eyes, however, remain on Amy, and the Grand Elder. He looks, very briefly, worried, though it passes rather quickly. Nothing else in the meeting seems to catch his dark eyes.*

[Bridget Geroux] Bridget finally retakes her seat, glass in hand. Her brown eyes shift around the room as if for a second, she forgot where she was. The kinswoman shakes it off and sips the remaining whiskey, her eyes floating somewhere between Patrick and Kieran for whatever reason.

[Honor's Compass] Honor's Compass, who has, up until this moment been relatively silent, merely a formidable presence in so far as a regal Silver Fang of her ranking should be, standing to one side with her arms neatly folded over her chest; her coat open to reveal silk blouse beneath, the designer jeans and knee-high boots.

Immaculate as ever, she somehow managed to avoid it becoming ridiculous; her carefully arranged hair; her glossed lips. It was the animal grace in her that controlled it; the thrill of danger posed by those pale eyes of hers as they sweep the assembly, as manicured nails close over the eight ball.

Her eyes find Sarita's sister.

"If I may, Rhya," she says in her voice, rippling with its hint of french gentility, "I have some knowledge of these goings on. I was approached here at the Brotherhood by Adara, Song of Life, a Black Fury Galliard I believe my Alpha put in charge of the Brotherhood plans, along with Adamidas. She told me of the issues with the Kinswoman."

A beat. "She asked my council, and two sides to this issue were brought before me, one from Garou and the other spoken on the behalf of the Kinfolk by one of Cockroaches Kin." The Fang's lip curves a little, inexplicably. "My sense was that they were working at cross-purposes, here. The Kinfolk, rightly enough, want their say in their own safety, but the Garou have their own notions on how Kinfolk need to be so protected.

My advice was to meet together, and discuss it. I believe this is the meeting Amunet is referring to."

[Nash] With his left hand, Nash reaches up to scrub at his scruffy face when the tiny Indian woman moves across the room and proceeds to cause the blood pressure of at least four Trueborn to spike. He doesn't sigh or stare, but when his hand comes away from his face and returns to his jacket pocket the kinsman glances over at Kora again.

That glance lasts only so long as the silence between active speakers; a few seconds after the regal blonde begins to speak, his eyes slowly drift away to acknowledge her.

[Rain McKellar] ((Rain will stay with the other Gaian kin until the meeting lets out, but her player must go to sleep soon. Thanks, all, for the scene.))

[Balance Without Fault] [night!]

[Danicka Musil] This time, the ball comes to Danicka more easily, since her mate has excused himself from the proceedings for the moment and it seems that Danicka doesn't trust herself to catch the bizarre little toy if lobbed her way. She hears about the defense plan -- something she's only heard rumors of, not the story she just got. She looks at Amunet briefly when she takes the 8-ball, but in the end, doesn't address the Strider kin as she did earlier.

"-Rhya," she says, to Balance Without Fault, "the Kinfolk have tried before to establish leadership amongst themselves before, but in that case and in this one, there's a serious problem with Garou being kept out of the loop." She thinks a moment. "If the Kinfolk want to be heard by the Garou -- to have a voice, for example, in deciding the defense plan for the Brotherhood of Thieves, to have at least some kind of vote in matters that affect them personally, then is there any reason why the Garou in charge of defense for this place should not have a Kinfolk -- preferably a resident -- whose counsel is sought in decisions about it?"

A beat. She blinks those round, green eyes of hers, turning to look at Amunet. "And maybe, if only to limit the amount of suspicion and paranoia and rumors of discontent, maybe an alliance of Kinfolk would have a better chance of success if there is a Garou involved in the proceedings and decisions being made -- not to dictate, not to rule, but to communicate the needs the Garou have to the Kin, and vice versa?"

[Balance Without Fault] Balance listens to Katherine with clear attentiveness; then Danicka.

"It's become increasingly clear to me tonight that some level of constant communication needs to be set up between the Garou of this Sept and the Kin. That's part of what I wanted to discuss when we talk about the coalition a little more. I realize I've delayed the discussion of the coalition again and again, but I'm going to have to ask for your patience a little longer."

He turns back to Amunet.

"There will always be some level of dictation, Amunet. I've said it before and I'll say it again. The Nation is not a democracy. There is one Grand Elder. One Warder. One warleader. One Garou in charge of the defense of the Brotherhood, and one Garou assisting her.

"It's not your place to rebel against that order. If you feel unheard, then speak. You may bring your suggestions up, just as anyone else can -- and it seems that with Honor's Compass's counsel, you intend to do exactly that.

"You may not, however, display blatant insubordination to those who rank over you. And you must understand that the final say still belongs to those charged with the keeping of the Brotherhood. This isn't a kin/Garou issue. It's a simple issue of hierarchy. I would say the same to your sister Sarita, or even to the Philodox Elder."

Balance turns the magic eightball over in his hands, then continues.

"The second point I wanted to address specifically is this. I've heard reports that you were seeking a Garou to ... beat you? And that you would tape this as some sort of instructional video?

"What's the story there, Amunet? I hardly know where to begin."

[Amunet Knezevic] She looks very tired, very suddenly, tongue bitten to keep herself quiet as she waits her turn.

[Kieran Mondblume] *He flinches visibly.*

[August Grant] A brow rose.

That sounded like the single most stupid idea she's heard in awhile.

Was that girl daft?

[Izzy Montoya] She's wanting.... what?! Izzy's head whips about so quickly her hair flies in a semi circle, smacking her in the face while she stares at Amunet with dropped jaw.... only to have it snap shut on the comment not quite bitten back..

"Motherfu..." snap.

She turns, and stalks to the kitchen. She needs a serious drink. Now.

[Quinn] Quinn actually does a double-take, and frowns at Amunet.Her thoughts are similar August's. What would that even teach?

[Kieran Mondblume] *He raises one hand, however, before forgetting himself, and he holds his hand out for the ball.*

[Jackson Montgomery] He blinks as the idea for the original plan comes out in a horribly mangled, telephone version of what was actually discussed. He looks at Balances With Fault, then at Amunet and back, before he takes a [[DIBS]] after Amunet.

[Bridget Geroux] Bridget tenses in her little corner of the world, and the nearly empty glass falls into her lap before she catches it. A slight amount of whiskey and ice bleed into the fabric.

"Shit," she says under her breath. Looking directly to BWF with an expression of apology, she zips it quickly, gathers her skirts, and moves towards the kitchen following Izzy.

[Kieran Mondblume] ((Though I am willing to wait for dibs till after Amy and Jackson have had their say))

[Leon Davenport] Leon blinked a few times, eyes on Amy. Ok...now that was..well..totally crazy even for her. He actually had to look at Sarita with a brow raised as if asking her..what the hell? But he doesn't say anything, doesn't smile or anything. He was mostly, perplexed by all of this.

He had an idea why she'd ask that, but to him it dodn't seem like the right way to do things.

[Danicka Musil] Danicka, in the face of people restraining the urge to curse, of staring, of double-takes... blinks at Amunet. There's no anger, no sudden omgwtfbbq. But surprise. And definite, strong interest in hearing something other than the rumor that Balance Without Fault wants to be explained and clarified.

[Gina McClaren] *Wait - woah.. What? Gina arcs her back away from Matt, squinting at the better bred strider kin across the room. Expression caugt between disgust and disbeleif. She looks up to Matt meaningfully, as if to say "Didn't I tell you? Crazy. Every fucking one of them." That flask gets retrieved and sampled from once more.*

[Amunet Knezevic] "Okay. So" She takes a deep breath. Remember what Stefan said, Ames...

"First of all, it was an idea that was being batted around. Just that. I'm unsure why everyone seems content to run around asking everyone else why I'm doing what I'm doing, but that seems to be the trend. It was considered, it was discussed, and nothing has been done. There's no reason for anyone to assume that it's moving forward.

As for being secretive and not wanting Garou involvement in the alliance, that is simply not true. The Shadow Lord Nathalie has offered her assistance, and I have taken her up on that. I'm not hiding anything. I'm not trying to exclude anyone that would benefit the alliance."

She gestures toward the departing Bridget. "She wants to talk, but she wasn't there for the conversation. She's referring to Adara, the Fury. She asked to be included in the alliance, and when reminded it was a kinfolk alliance, she compared it to the KKK. Jackson was there for the conversation. I'm sure he can back me up. My issue with allowing her to be part of this isn't that she's Garou, it's that she's a shitty excuse for a Garou."

[Quinn] [dibs!]

[Wyrmbreaker] [Dibs is Jackson, Kieran, Quinn right now -- though BWF might cut in line at some point!]

[Quinn] [WHOOPS! That was supposed to be Joey!]

[Amunet Knezevic] [I'm assuming she'll be asked to explain that....]

[Wyrmbreaker] [joey --> jackson --> kieran]

[Kieran Mondblume] ((And Ki gives up his dibs.)) *He lowers his hand again, and then he goes back to listening.*

[Honor's Compass] [Damn it, now Kate has to speak up. SORRY.]

[Wyrmbreaker] [kate --> joey --> jackson --> kieran]

[Matthieu] His eyes meet Gina's own and he looks back at the kin though he doesn't nod. His eyes say enough and he reassures her with a slight pat to the small of her back. Though the Galliard doesn't wish to appear as if he isn't listening and taking in every word. Indeed he was listening to everything that was said. Formulating an opinion on each and every personality that shows itself here tonight.

[Izzy Montoya] She's not long. Long enough to have a shot and pour a second that she brings with her, in time to hear that it was just an idea being bat around, without nay explanation whatsoever. Her jaw tenses, and she finds a space of wall to lean against, setting the glass on the table and lighting another cigarette.

[Jackson Montgomery] [[Officially voicing a request to try to keep a bit closer to the 10 minute posting limit that was established for Dibbers.]]

[Honor's Compass] Katherine's eyes cut toward Amy.

"That is the second occasion I have heard, and the first directly from your lips of insult to Song of Life, Amunet. I do not care who you believe you are, who your mate is or how valid your cause -- you will pay the respect due to a Garou or you will be sending your mate to every door in the Sept to make amends for your mouth.

I said it before, I say it again.

Respectful disagreement."

[Bridget Geroux] Bridget returns soon after, patting at her skirt with a towel. She passes Izzy and takes her seat again, then offers her hand up to speak for the second time.

[Bridget Geroux] [Dibs when it gets her direction]

[Kora] Kora does not glance at Amunet. Her dark eyes track Izzy, though, as she weaves through the room. Then, the creature glances back at Nash. Fine blond brows arch eloquently over her shadowed eyes. Restlessness runs patterned beneath her skin. Even standing still she looks ready to prowl.

[Wyrmbreaker] [joey --> jackson --> kieran --> bridget]

[August Grant] Even though she really, really wanted to be here for this lovely conversation - the pregnant girl's bladder could only hold out so long. So, carefully enough, she made her way to the ladies room .. and then to the kitchen, where she'd find a snack and linger in the door for a moment eating before returning to her chair.

[Joey] The magic eight ball starts to head toward another kin, but the Fostern Rotagar indicates the need for an interception. It goes to Kate first, and when it gets to Joey, she palms it, and inclines her head toward Amy.

"Just t'clarify, this idea," she reaches up her free hand to pantomime air quotes, "was brought to the elders 'cause you'd already gone at least to Burnout lookin' for a volunteer. And when I talked to you about it, everything you said told me you were set on goin' through with it, despite warnings and consequences.

"So you're not bein' called out on it just 'cause someone's followin' some sort've trend."

The eight ball is passed on.

[Kieran Mondblume] ((Ki actually gave up his dibs.))

[Amunet Knezevic] [dibs after bridget, please]

[Wyrmbreaker] [jackson --> bridget --> amunet!]

[Jackson Montgomery] He takes the 8=Ball and steps forward. "Just to provide my own perspective on this idea. Which, at least when we discussed it, was just an idea. It was brainstorming possibilities, nothing more. Amunet asked me, since I was a film student, if there was a way for us to be able to film...not a Garou beating the tar out of a kinfolk, Amy or otherwise. But potential sparring sessions. The reason for this would be that, if we were in a situation where combat was inevitable, we'd be more capable. This wasn't 'Beat the shit out of me and film it and you'll know what it's like to be in a fight. Hell, a Garou could spar with someone in homid and we could film that. These specifics weren't even gone over because it was one three minute portion of one much longer discussion.

"The key was, and what we were discussing, was that if it was done, it would have to be done securely. No internet access to the video. Not multiple copies floating around. Again, this was a big if, and I felt it was conceivably possible, if not a sure thing. No one was setting up sets or anything like that, I wasn't figuring out lighting and camera angles or what lens to use. As near as I knew, Amunet was checking with Garou to see if there would even be volunteers, because if not the rest didn't even matter.

He frowns. "If there was some kind of telephone situation where it wasn't properly communicated, then there you have it. But the idea was far saner and far more brainstorming than that I just heard. Obviously the Veil was our first concern and what we were discussing before any considerations came into play."

[Hunter] [hunter taking dibs after bridget, before amunet]

[Gina McClaren] *Gina's taking a fourth shot. Amazing how much alcohol can disappear into the little Indian woman in so short a period of time. The flask's cap clinks metallic and resolute as its popped on tightly. Flask itself handed to Leon, a flat palm held up, then making an abrupt cutting motion. The fuzziness in her stomach and the hazy tingle behind brown eyes told her anymore would loosen her tongue, and no one wanted that tonight. So the woman who was rapidly becoming a lush entrusts her fire water to the Glasswalker , before settling back against the Silverfang's comforting hand. Her eyes slip firmly shut.*

[Balance Without Fault] [bridget --> hunter --> amunet]

[Bridget Geroux] "That reminds me when Carter took your injuries last time. We all asked you about the bruises and you wouldn't answer. I let it go because you seemed uncomfortable, but if I thought for a second you might want someone to beat you up... What the hell, Amy? How do you expect to display leadership among us with... whatever is going on?"

She stops and shakes her head. "I'm sorry, Amy. That got a bit too personal. But when I saw you talking to Song of Life, I just couldn't hear it anymore. By the way, she has shown nothing but the utmost respect for my crazy ass ways and was one of the very few Garou who has encouraged me to keep doing my work rather than some Garou who have discouraged me from it. Maybe they've done it because they cared, but she is one of the few Garou I'd be more than willing to invite to my own house just to shoot the shit. I respect and admire the hell out of the Garou who treat kinfolk-- even those not of their tribe-- like the family we are. Family might be my whole grievance in the first place."

"My other issue with the alliance is, like Danicka repeated earlier, that it is too jealously guarded, even from other kinfolk. My father, Meuric 'Bear' Geroux for those of you who care about the formality, used to tell me all the time how Septs grow weaker when not even the kinfolk can rely on one another as family."

[Leon Davenport] He looked at Gina with a grin and took the flask out of her hand, making it disapear in his suit's jacket. He nodded to her, letting her know it will be returned to her eventually. Not that it wasn't a big deal if she had something of hers. She had something of him.

So it was with familiarity that he gently nudge her before looking back at those talking.

[Bridget Geroux] [First part got cut off:]
Bridget looks towards Amy with raised eyebrows as she takes the 8 ball, an expression of genuine concern.

[Balance Without Fault] [hunter's up, then amunet, then BWF is taking the ball]

[Hunter] [oh shit browser didn't refresh gimme a minute]

[Danicka Musil] At the bar, Danicka glances at the door, wondering about her mate, and frankly about Carter. She sips her water and returns her attention to the discussion. There's no lightly thoughtful look on her face now. She's quite serious. Bordering, in fact, on visibly tense.

[Hunter] The eight ball gets grasped in one meaty palm and he doesn't stand to speak.

"Amy came to me first I believe, out of any Garou, sayin' she wanted me to do it. I explained this to her at the time but I'll repeat it because it seems ya' don't quite get it Jackson."

A beat.

"For starters, Amy squarin' off vs me in any form is just gonna be a beatin' plain n' simple. That's just all there is to it. Secondly from what I was told the purposes for doin' this was so that kinfolk could get some expertise on how to fight against a fuckin' spiral -- scuse ma language -- n'that she'd want me to fight her not just in human form.

Now I don't know what ya' know bout' spirals but fightin' ya' is about the last thing they're gonna do. It won't be in human form, so sparrin' vs me in homid ain't gonna teach ya' shit. It won't be to kill ya' n'I don't think I need to -- nor should I try to, or am adequately able to -- express just what they'd be tryin' to do.

The flaws of this video been pointed out by my Beta quite clearly to Amy, but from where I stand there's some seriously misguided ideas based on the fact that ya' thought that me puttin' a kin near death would actually help anyone learn anythin' of value against that group'a devils."

There's a beat and then:

"The fact that ya' thought me doin' that could help is, quite frankly, god damn insultin'."